I do feel empathy to this woman. At first, no I did not. I get outraged and speak (or in this case) type before I really sit down and think about the circumstances. Although I don't think I ever said anything bad about this woman on here, just stating that just because she has a mental illness doesn't autmatically excuse her.

But anyways, what I meant by jumping on a pity party is it seems like as soon as the thread was posted everyone came out all like defending the mother, instead of talking about how horrible the fate of this child was, or what he might have gone through in his short life. I feel WAY more pity for the child, than the mother, but it seemed like everyone's first reaction was to defend the mother.

but it seemed like everyone's first reaction was to defend the mother.

Just because it isn't seen doesn't mean it isn't felt. I'm sure EVERYONE in this forum (as long as they are normal, lol) did IMMEDIATELY feel pity for the child and outrage that this happened. And still do.

It just seemed that way, bc they were more people responding about the mother, rather than the child.

Sometimes people feel a need to defend someone when they think someone is being wrongfully overly judged. And in this case, that's how some people felt about the situation given the circumstances. I don't think anyone feels WORSE for the mother than the child, just differently. You'd have to be a pretty dark person indeed to not feel some amount of anger for what happened to the child above the empathy for the mother.

ACTUALLY, THE FIRST REACTIONS TO THIS NEWS ITEM WERE THINGS LIKE 'THIS WOMAN DESERVES TO DIE' OR 'I CAN'T COMPREHEND HOW A MOTHER COULD DO THIS'. SO THAT IS WHY I POSTED ABOUT MENTAL ILLNESS, SO THAT IT COULD BE MORE UNDERSTOOD. I ALWAYS THINK IT'S IMPORTANT TO LOOK AT BOTH SIDES OF A STORY. PERSONALLY, I DIDN'T SAY 'OMG, THE POOR BABY!' BECAUSE, LIKE, THAT GOES WITHOUT SAYING. THERE IS NO NEED TO SAY IT. IT'S OBVIOUS, YO. SO THERE IS NOTHING TO BE ACHIEVED, COMMUNICATION-WISE, BY DISCUSSING HOW TERRIBLE IT IS - LIKE EVERYONE KNOWS IT'S TERRIBLE. I'M PRETTY SURE THERE IS NO ONE HERE WHO THINKS THAT ACTUALLY IT'S QUITE A GOOD IDEA TO EAT A BABY'S BRAINS!

ALTHOUGH I DO ACTUALLY FEEL MORE PITY FOR THE MOTHER, BECAUSE THE BABY IS DEAD. HOW CAN YOU PITY A DEAD PERSON? THE MOTHER IS STILL ALIVE AND LIVING WITH IT. ALL THE PITY IN THE WORLD WILL NOT BRING THE DEAD BABY BACK TO LIFE, SO THE IMPORTANT THING NOW IS TO FOCUS ON THE MOTHER, AND WHAT NEEDS TO BE DONE TO HELP HER AND TO PREVENT HER DOING SUCH A THING AGAIN. TO SAY THAT THE MOTHER'S BRAINS NEED TO BE EATEN AS PUNISHMENT DOESN'T SEEM LIKE A VERY HELPFUL WAY OF DEALING WITH THE SITUATION TO ME. IT SIMPLY WOULDN'T ACHIEVE ANYTHING CONSTRUCTIVE. IT CERTAINLY WON'T DO ANYTHING TO HELP THE DEAD BABY.

ALSO, YO, CONSIDER THIS. THERE ARE MANY PEOPLE WITH MENTAL ILLNESSES IN THE WORLD, AND ALSO A LOT OF IGNORANCE ABOUT MENTAL ILLNESS. PEOPLE WITH MENTAL ILLNESSES ARE OFTEN SEEN AS EVIL OR SCARY AND ARE THUS ISOLATED IN SOCIETY - WHICH MAKES INCIDENTS LIKE THIS MORE LIKELY, BECAUSE THEY HAVE NO FRIENDS AROUND TO SEE THEY HAVE A PROBLEM AND GET HELP FOR THEM.

SO, IN THE LIGHT OF THIS, WHAT IS THE BEST WAY TO CONTRIBUTE TO MINIMISATION OF SUCH THINGS OCCURRING IN FUTURE? IS IT TO SAY 'OMG, WHAT AN EVIL WOMAN - I HOPE SHE ROTS!' OR IS IT TO TRY TO CREATE SOME UNDERSTANDING OF MENTAL ILLNESS? PERSONALLY, I'D SAY THE LATTER, AND THAT IS WHY I CONTRIBUTE TO THE THREAD WITH INFORMATION ABOUT MENTAL ILLNESS. I THINK THAT EXPRESSING HATE FOR THIS WOMAN IS ACTUALLY PERPETUATING ISOLATION OF MENTALLY ILL PEOPLE WHICH MAKE SUCH INCIDENTS MORE LIKELY. SOMETIMES IT'S IMPORTANT TO LOOK BEYOND YOUR IMMEDIATE EMOTIONAL RESPONSE AND SEE WHAT WOULD BE MORE HELPFUL FOR SOCIETY IN GENERAL.

Very well said. :)

Just 25 years ago there was also a great deal of misunderstanding about another disease... HIV. People really believed that you could catch HIV by touching someone who was HIV positive... people really believed that if someone was HIV positive they must be homosexual. The ignorance surrounding THAT disease was insane. Thankfully we've moved on, and most people now have a far better understanding of HIV.

So why is it SO difficult to educate people on mental illness?

I will say this though... I think things are slightly better in the UK, and I think this is because British TV dramas and soaps are quite good at providing well researched storylines on mental illness. The major one was the Eastenders schizophrenia story about 10 years ago... I think that educated a lot of people. Hollyoaks have also had one on schizophrenia.

But it seems to be a subject American dramas steer away from or portray badly. And it tends to focus on 'trendy' psychiatric disorders, like bipolar disorder (which just about every other celebrity is claiming to have these days), as 90210 did with Silver (although to be fair, they portrayed that very well).

There is however a couple of very good American produced movies on schizophrenia... A Beautiful Mind, and Fight Club. What both those movies do very well is show just how REAL the delusions, hallucinations are to the person experiencing them. I think they're movies everyone should watch some time.

OH YES, YO - DIDN'T STACY IN EASTENDERS HAVE BIPOLAR QUITE RECENTLY? LIKE, I DON'T WATCH IT, BUT I HAPPENED TO SEE AN EPISODE AT WORK. AND WE ALSO HAVE FAMOUS PEOPLE LIKE STEPHEN FRY RAISING AWARENESS.

GOSH, I TOTALLY HAVE THE VIDEO OF BEAUTIFUL MIND AND HAVE NEVER GOT ROUND TO WATCHING IT - I MUST WATCH IT SOMETIME.

I don't watch any British TV, but I can agree 100% with the statement that American dramas portray it badly.

*shrug*

Who cares about the child right? Such a horrible three-week life, but he's all up in heaven now, floating in the clouds with God's warm love, right?

What's to discuss?

I don't understand what you are saying. Are you trying to be sarcastic? I don't get you putting right at the end of that.

Oh yes. I'm being quite sarcastic. Tragic event. People die, but in the end, does it really matter? Those dead are supposedly with God, and those that committed the crime will face his judgment, after facing judgment by their peers.

*shrug* It's the same reaction to every violent crime, no matter the circumstances. And everyone gets all up in arms about it (myself included) and discusses and analyzes and beats the issue into the ground on both sides of the argument (or more), pointing out what could have been done or what should have been done or what shouldn't have been done or what they would do if it was them or how it could have been avoided with the usage of personal anecdotes, etc. etc.

Mother is crazy. Baby is dead. Tragic, horrible situation. Obviously shit was wrong, but beating the mother to a pulp isn't going to bring the baby back to life, and since the mother stabbed herself after realizing what she had done, clearly she felt such immense guilt and remorse that she wanted to off herself, or something pretty close to that.

She's going to feel sorry for what she did, and it's going to haunt her the rest of her life. If she gets life in prison, without parole, because of what she did, it's essentially punishing her for past mistakes caused in part by mental illness and deluded thinking that comes with it. What about the mentally challenged teenager who sets the neighbors house on fire by accident? They're mentally ill/handicapped as well. Should they stand trial as an arsonist when they didn't know what they were doing?. Why should the woman who is just as equally out of touch with reality and has an equal lack of understanding and perception be given the same fate?

On the flipside, the woman won't be in danger of running the risk of such a situation happening again because she'd be in jail, but whose to say that will solve anything? Giving her the death penalty for a horrible, horrible mistake doesn't seem quite fair either, because then all your left with is death, blood and a bad feeling overall. Letting her walk free doesn't seem quite right as well either.

This isn't such a cut-and-dry situation, so people need to stop making it out to be that way. If you lack the understanding to draw on outside variables and circumstances, and you lack the intelligence and restraint to stop for a moment and think about the entire situation, and the feelings of the mother, the father, the family, the police, everyone involved, and take it ALL into equal consideration, then don't even bother to open your mouth in the first place.

I don't ever remember saying that I wanted to beat the pulp out of her. All I have said is being schizophrenic doesn't automatically excuse her there are a lot of other factors that play into it. I don't think everyone should "burn her at the stacks" either. I just think that she needs serious help. She should be in a mental hospital for the rest of her life where she can not hurt herself or any other innocent human being.

I don't think it has anything to do with being a mother. I think it has to do with having an understanding (or lack of) of mental illness, in particular psychotic disorders like schizophrenia. If you really understood schizophrenia, you would not make many of the statements you've made here, mother or not.

As for why people are defending her... well I think it's obvious that everyone feels for that poor baby. Of course we do. There's no need to discuss that, because it goes without saying. However, people were attacking this woman, calling her evil, saying she deserved to die... and showing a huge amount of ignorance about mental health problems. So of course people have stepped in to try and educate them on the matter, because if this woman was psychotic (and it's likely she was), someone has to defend her from the people who are so heartlessly attacking her. Her life had been destroyed by this, surely that's bad enough.

That is disgusting! Wow, that woman clearly has major issues. She needs to be sterilized and then charged the highest punishment possible. That is sick. If she knew she felt off, then maybe she should of told someone so they could of taken that child to safety. I feel so horrible for that innocent child.

Yeah... lets just sterilise all the schizophrenics. *sigh* Once again the ignorance surrounding mental illness doesn't fail to shock me.

And how many times do we have to say this... schizophrenics usually do NOT KNOW they're 'feeling off'. They feel fine (well, not fine, usually rather distressed. But they believe what they are experiencing is real). They do not believe they are unwell. It is a symptom of the disease. You can not blame HER for not seeking help, when it was the disease that prevented her from recognising something was wrong.

What is wrong with you? Seriously, you cannot be defending her! That is sick. Yes, sterilization is a must. I cannot believe your honestly defending this woman. Imagine the pain that child endured! That poor child couldn't scream for help, the child was helpless and just had to take it. That isn't fair! That is plain sick! The only victim in this story is the child, NOT the woman!

What is wrong with me is I don't see things in black and white, and I have enough knowledge about mental illness (in her case, schizophrenia) to know that this was most likely something which happened as a result of her ILLNESS. I have the knowledge to know that people with schizophrenia often do not feel in control of their actions... to know that what they are experiencing is as real to them, as this conversation with you is real to me right now.... I have the knowledge to know that people with schizophrenia typically do NOT believe they are ill and you cannot force them to believe it (they can only gain insight if their condition is treated with medication)...

I mean if I said to you... "your family does not exist. They're all in your head. Take this tablet and it'll cure you and make them go away." would you take it? No, of course you wouldn't. You'd probably think I was mad! Because your family are real. Or so you believe with 100% certainty. JUST as schizophrenics believe with 100% certainty that their delusions and hallucinations are real. THAT is the thought process that schizophrenics have.

Believe me, I am not sick. I am just not ignorant like you and jumping to condemn her.

You call everyone ignorant. Seeing your posts and responses, it's either your way or the highway. You think your the only person who can have an opinion that is the right opinion.

I'm afraid I'm on Fraggle's side here. Yes it's fucked up but it is better to understand her reasons for doing it, rather than calling her every name under the sun. That's not going to change anything, but understanding a mental illness will.

update on woman. yeah the article's epicly long, so i won't post it, but apparently she refused medication for pre-existing schizophrenia. and also had access to samurai swords. what a winning combo.

See that's what I'm talking about, everyone started making excuses for her, but really she refused to take her medication. So that makes her responsible for her actions, no matter what she did. She knew that she had a problem and didn't take her medicine or get help for it and because of that her baby suffered a horrible horrible death at the hands of the one person in the world who was supposed to love and protect him.

AGAIN... she probably refused her medication because she did not believe she was ill. That's extremely common in schizophrenia.

If anyone is to blame, it's her psychiatric team who didn't FORCE her to take her medication (as this can be done).

blah blah blah..bottom line is she is fucked up in the head. She did something terrible, people are going to judge her for it.

Well, that's mature. :P

I guess you must be 'fucked up in the head' too then, since you say you too have experienced hallucinations in the past.

I wasn't talking about people judging her. I was talking about the fact you KEEP saying that she was responsible for her actions because she should have recognised she was sick and asked for her help. When it is a simple fact that one of the core features of schizophrenia is a lack of insight. They do not believe they are sick because the experience is so REAL to them. So of course many refuse medication. As I'm sure you would too if someone tried to force you to take medication you didn't believe you needed.

Clearly this is a fact that disputes your argument that she must be a bad person, and so rather than discuss it you resort to "blah blah blah". When people have that sort of attitude there will always be ignorance surrounding mental health problems. Very sad.