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School tells student he will be suspended if he
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9 May 2009, 08:07
.love.struck.
Post Count: 492
Seriously? WTF? This is a huge example why religion is a huge joke. Listening to rock music is not evil, holding hands doesn't mean kids are going to have sex, and not everyone has sex on prom night or drinks alcohol. If a parent did a good job at teaching their kids good morals and ethics then there is no worry. I personally think what he does outside of school is none of the schools business. People who think this way are stuck in time. I didn't have sex on prom night or drink! I would sue if I was this boys parents. Let the parents do the discipline to their own child, not the damn school. I personally think what this school is doing is illegal. I would raise hell if this happened to my child.

FINDLAY, Ohio A student at a fundamentalist Baptist school that forbids dancing, rock music, hand-holding and kissing will be suspended if he takes his girlfriend to her public high school prom, his principal said.

Despite the warning, 17-year-old Tyler Frost, who has never been to a dance before, said he plans to attend Findlay High School's prom Saturday.

Frost, a senior at Heritage Christian School in northwest Ohio, agreed to the school's rules when he signed a statement of cooperation at the beginning of the year, principal Tim England said.

The teen, who is scheduled to receive his diploma May 24, would be suspended from classes and receive an "incomplete" on remaining assignments, England said. Frost also would not be permitted to attend graduation but would get a diploma once he completes final exams. If Frost is involved with alcohol or sex at the prom, he will be expelled, England said.

Frost's stepfather Stephan Johnson said the school's rules should not apply outside the classroom.

"He deserves to wear that cap and gown," Johnson said.

Frost said he thought he had handled the situation properly. Findlay requires students from other schools attending the prom to get a signature from their principal, which Frost did.

"I expected a short lecture about making the right decisions and not doing something stupid," Frost said. "I thought I would get his signature and that would be the end."

England acknowledged signing the form but warned Frost there would be consequences if he attended the dance. England then took the issue to a school committee made up of church members, who decided to threaten Frost with suspension.

"In life, we constantly make decisions whether we are going to please self or please God. (Frost) chose one path, and the school committee chose the other," England said.

The handbook for the 84-student Christian school says rock music "is part of the counterculture which seeks to implant seeds of rebellion in young people's hearts and minds."

England said Frost's family should not be surprised by the school's position.

"For the parents to claim any injustice regarding this issue is at best forgetful and at worst disingenuous," he said. "It is our hope that the student and his parents will abide by the policies they have already agreed to."

The principal at Findlay High School, whose graduates include Pittsburgh Steelers quarterback Ben Roethlisberger, said he respects, but does not agree with, Heritage Christian School's view of prom.

"I don't see (dancing and rock music) as immoral acts," Craig Kupferberg said.

Information from: The Courier, http://www.thecourier.com
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9 May 2009, 16:26
Riot
Post Count: 31
If he signed the paper at the beginning of the year, he should respect the rules, religious or not.

That said, rock does change your attitude. I'm not saying that it is evil in and of itself, but it does help to plant certain seeds that could lead one astray. I've seen many fellow Christians backslide, and it almost always seems to include secular music (rock, rap, or even country sometimes) being the first thing that they let into their heads.

GIGO - Garbage In, Garbage Out.

If you let that stuff into your head and mind, then you'll start thinking like it does. It's the same way with friends. If you wanna be a devout Christian, your core group of friends need to be devout christians. If you don't wanna do drugs, don't become close friends with all druggies. It's the same principle. You may say it's not, but I've seen it happen way too many times (and it happened personally, as well) for me not to realize that that music does have some kind of affect on a person's attitude.
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9 May 2009, 16:55
~RedFraggle~
Post Count: 2651
Maybe the Christians you're friends with are just weaker than others. I know plenty of devout Christians who haven't been 'lead astray' by listening to mainstream pop/rock. I mean what sort of person lives their lives by the lyrics of a song? I for one tend not to even listen to the lyrics half the time.
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9 May 2009, 16:56
~RedFraggle~
Post Count: 2651
Oops, that should have been 'lives their life'. Just before someone else corrects me. ;)
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10 May 2009, 07:10
lithium layouts.
Post Count: 836
I'm a devout Christian. I believe in God. I don't do drugs, I don't sleep around (I'm still a virgin and am waiting for marriage), I don't drink to get drunk, and I listen to heavy metal (and have been for the past 5 years). My boyfriend is agnostic. A number of my friends have done drugs in the past.

Not saying I'm the norm. Just saying that you don't need to abstain from rock and hang out exclusively with Christians in order to be a devout Christian yourself.

In fact, it's often in becoming friends with non-Christians that you learn more about Christianity, in terms of others' perceptions of it, and it forces you to think about it in a way you haven't thought before, in order to explain to them what it means to you to be Christian.
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10 May 2009, 12:26
Acid Fairy
Post Count: 1849
'That said, rock does change your attitude.'

Can I just say LOL?!

I'm sorry, but that is possibly the strangest thing I have ever heard.
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9 May 2009, 16:52
~RedFraggle~
Post Count: 2651
Oh, I also meant to say, it is not fair to use this as a basis for saying "religion is a huge joke". Because this isn't typical of religion (or even of Christianity). It is one extreme end of the scale of religion. To assume all Christians are like that or that it is representative of religion in general is just plain wrong.

Plus, as I've already said, I don't think it's really about religion, but rather about power and control. The religion is just an excuse.
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9 May 2009, 17:43
Leona Wren
Post Count: 425
I commend you for saying what you did here. This case is not good basis to saying religion is a joke. Because as you have stated, this is just one extreme end of the scale of religion.

Nicely said.
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10 May 2009, 00:28
Mary Magdelene
Post Count: 506
Ok, first, not all Christians are like this school, therefore your statement of "religion is a huge joke" based on what these particular people do is what is the joke.

Second, the boy knew the rules of the school BEFORE he signed the paper agreeing to them. REGARDLESS of whether or not it makes no sense OUTSIDE of that particular school, he KNEW those were the rules when he signed them, and if he had a problem with them he shouldn't have signed and he should have gone somewhere else. And while the school should not have any business in what the students do outside of the school, the fact remains that those were the rules and he knew them, and he signed the agreement anyway.

He knew the rules beforehand, and now he chooses to break them. If he gets expelled it's his own fault.
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10 May 2009, 00:31
Mary Magdelene
Post Count: 506
So all religion is a huge joke because of the actions of some? THAT STATEMENT is what is a huge joke.

And frankly, it's his own fault if he gets expelled. He KNEW what the rules stated before he signed the paper, and he signed them anyway, thus stating that he would uphold the agreement. If he didn't like what the agreement said, then he shouldn't have signed the papers and he shouldn't have gone to that school. Regardless of the fact that the school really shouldn't have anything to do with what the students do outside of the school, the fact remains that he knew that's what the agreement he signed said, and he signed it.
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10 May 2009, 00:31
Mary Magdelene
Post Count: 506
Ok, this is ridiculous. I didn't even SEND that previous comment, the page froze on me, and it went blank. NOW it shows it sent. *grrrr*
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10 May 2009, 12:25
Acid Fairy
Post Count: 1849
LOL. Oh this amuses me. What retards.

And for one, I LOVE rock music and I have hardly been 'led astray'. I take 2 academic courses and hold down a job and a steady boyfriend. Yeah, I'm such a badass ;D
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12 May 2009, 17:57
♥ jes
Post Count: 135
Some religions are strict like that. It doesn't mean that the religion is a joke.
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9 May 2009, 08:27
Lady Lazarus
Post Count: 126
This is a toughie.

On the one hand, if a school can punish you for things you do outside of the classroom that are completely within the law, where do they draw the line? It's a bit creepy.

On the other hand I dyed my hair whilst at high school and got threatened with suspension. I didn't dye my hair within school grounds and it was a completely legal thing to do, but it was against school rules.

I know it's completely daft to us, but that's because we don't believe what they believe. The whole point of school (other than the qualifications obviously) is to learn to abide by a system that you may not always agree with, but must obey all the same. It's learning to live with rules. It sucks, and some rebel, but thats just life for religous and non-religious students...

And of course the media are always very good at laying it on thick in the hopes of causing a controvesy, so I wouldn't really rely on a newspaper to give me the two sides of the story.

All that being said, if that was me and it was my school... I'd move schools.
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9 May 2009, 17:12
Villy
Post Count: 204
Yes but if you dye your hair, they still have to see it. Its against a dress code, I assume? They have every right to give you a slap on the wrist if you go against the dress code. Sure, you didn't dye your hair on school grounds, but it was still dyed when you got to school, yes?

But if this kid goes to a dance at a DIFFERENT school, obviously outside of school hours and off school grounds, they shouldn't be able to have any jurisdiction.

Its insane. And one reason why no child of mine will EVER go to a private school. Especially a religious one.
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10 May 2009, 12:29
Acid Fairy
Post Count: 1849
Haha that reminds me of my stupid school rule about wearing nail varnish. I never understood it so every day I came in wearing nail varnish, and every day they made me take it off. For 5 years. I thank the school for teaching me determination ;D
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9 May 2009, 08:50
neverpretty
Post Count: 35
At my school, if you were seen smoking at all by a teacher, it was grounds for suspension, regardless of whether it was off school grounds, the weekend, etc. certain schools have certain regulations that dictate lifestyle, particularly private schools; nothing illegal about that. ridiculous, sure, but hey, they chose to send their child to that school and were already aware of the it's position on such things.
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9 May 2009, 09:56
~RedFraggle~
Post Count: 2651
That's insane. I add this sort of thing to my list of reasons why I wouldn't want to live in America. How utterly ridiculous.

Firstly, the issue is over the boy's actions outside of the school, so how on earth can the school try and punish him for something he has done outside of school grounds?
Secondly, how exactly does his head teacher expect to KNOW if he's drank or had sex? Are they going to be spying on him? Or breathalising him afterwards?
Thirdly, how does going to a school dance equate to having sex and drinking anyway? Plenty of teens attend prom and do neither. I certainly didn't have sex on my prom night! (I did drink, but I was 18, and it was legal. The bar was very strict on only serving over-18s).

And finally, in a few months time, these kids are going to be out in the big wide world by themselves. The school can't 'protect' them from reality forever. Personally I don't think this is actually about religion. It's about power and control.
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9 May 2009, 11:57
Kelly
Post Count: 22
This isn't an AMERICAN thing.

Americans think it's insane, too.

The school, not Baptism or American culture, is insane.

But there's usually 3 sides to every story, too, and I have a feeling there's more to this story than this. There's the school's side, the student's side, and the truth.
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9 May 2009, 14:07
~RedFraggle~
Post Count: 2651
No, but you would never see something as ridiculous as this happening in the UK or Australia.
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9 May 2009, 14:27
Meghans Follie
Post Count: 433
Check out Newbold College's guidelines... Its there in the UK (england to be more exact) Its a private denomination based school, and it has some of the same "ridiculous" guidelines.
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9 May 2009, 15:45
starsmaycollide
Post Count: 408
Never, really? Why generalize?
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9 May 2009, 16:46
~RedFraggle~
Post Count: 2651
OK, perhaps I should have said 'extremely unlikely' rather than never. Particularly as Jodi has managed to identify one such school in the UK. ;) There is good reason for generalising though, because there are very very few 'fundamentalist Christians' in the UK, and a very tiny amount of schools like that. There is a far higher proportion of such Christians (and hence such schools) in the US. It is also part of the reason why there's a far higher proportion of conservatives in the US than in the UK, and why someone like Bush would probably never have been elected in a country like the UK.

So yes, I agree I should never say never, but the likelihood of something like this happening is far far higher in the US than in the UK (or Australia or Canada).
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10 May 2009, 12:30
Acid Fairy
Post Count: 1849
Very true.
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9 May 2009, 14:08
& skull.
Post Count: 1701
well no offence to any americans, but this sort of thing seems to happen more frequently in america that it does in the uk or australia. hence why some people think "what the fuck is wrong with some of the people over there?"

that thought aside, this is ridiculous though. smoking or being rude to people outside of school getting you into trouble is one thing, going to a freaking dance is another.
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