lol i wouldn't have a clue what to do with a circumsized penis! like hand jobs! how do you do that without the skin? and it'd be like...eugh! willies without them are ugly! better to have them covered up! lol!

@November Butterfly: Haha willies are ugly fullstop!

@Acid Fairy: so true! Although I find circumcised penises more attractive than uncircumcised. Just a cultural thing here though. lol

Lots of people who didn't get their ears pinned as children wished they had. Difference between a penis and an ear is that an adult can easily get their foreskin removed, but for an adult to get their ear pinned, it's more complicated and will likely look unnatural - so ear pinning is important to get done in early childhood, whereas circumcision can be done whenever.

And with regard to being 'cultural', you could say that of all kinds of things. You could say ear pinning is cultural to the UK, because it's seen as a normal procedure here - it's cultural for people to want ears that aren't bent in half. Just like in America, it's cultural for people to want 'perfect teeth' - so my dentist told me back in the day, when I was deciding whether to have a brace. He said it was optional, as my teeth weren't causing a problem, just sticking out - buck teeth! He told me it wasn't necessary, and I could choose, and he said something about how in America everyone wants perfect teeth, but in the UK it's not such a big deal. I totally wrote to my American penpal after that and asked if it was true that Americans all want perfect teeth, and she replied 'Yes, I guess so'! ;D I chose to have a brace anyway, and am glad I did, because my teeth look a lot better, and if I'd waited till adulthood I'd have had to wear the brace for a lot longer, and it would have been more complicated. And if I'd had a folded-over ear, it would have been the same - I'd have wanted to have it fixed in childhood.

@Dimples: They are both surgeries. They are both purely cosmetic.

However they are also different. Ears are on show to everyone ALL of the time. Penises are generally not. A foreskin is a completely NORMAL part of human anatomy. Prominent ears which warrant surgery are those which are outwith the 'normal' appearance of ears.

If a guy wishes he'd been circumcised, that is easily fixed and he can have it done as an adult. At least then it is his CHOICE. A child gets to be involved in the decision to have his/her ears pinned... the babies who are circumcised at birth have no say whatsover before having their bodies mutilated by their parents for purely cosmetic purposes.

In some countries in the world female circumcision is considered 'cultural', so do you also think that is an acceptable practice? I mean, if being 'cultural' makes it OK?

To consider performing cosmetic surgery to alter the normal anatomy of baby boys, without their consent to be acceptable, it is then completely hypocritical to be against the correction of abnormal anatomy, at the request of a child who is old enough to be involved in the decision.

@dimples, it's really not that different, though. Either way, YOU are making a decision to alter your childs body solely for cosmetic purposes. A decision that some feel should be left up to the child. The whole "it's cleaner" theory has already been debunked. The fact is, a circumcised penis is not any cleaner than an uncircumcised penis. Either penis is just as clean as the other, as long as the person responsible for the penis care (lol) is practicing good hygeine. No, they might not remember it.. but it's very common for guys to have complications from circumcision later in life. Even when a circumcision goes per routine & the infant seems to heal fine, it's very common for adult males to develope complications due to circumcision. Meatal stenosis, meatal ulcers, neuroma, buried penis, hairy shaft, webbing, etc. There are procedures adult males due to "restore" the skin lost during circumcision. It's more common for a man to regret his circumcision that he had no say so over, than one would think.

I'm against any physical alteration of my childrens bodies for the sole purpose of cosmetics or vanity, period.

In this case, like I said, if my daughter expressed the desire to have the procedure done, I would allow her to have it done. I would be very careful to explain all of the risks to her, the procedure itself, let her know it's not going to be comfortable and there will be pain involved, but in the end, it would ultimately be her decision.

However, I would never look at my own child & say, "oh, this isn't perfect and she is going to be made fun of, let's go have it cut/pinned/removed/etc." It will always be their decision. If there is no health benefit, it isn't done, period.

It isn't "Oh my child isn't perfect," it's "My child is being tormented." Mental and social health benefits are health benefits. But, to each their own.

And all I'm saying is, as long as this was something the girl wanted to have done, I see nothing wrong with it. If it were a case of the parent forcing it on the girl because they were bothered by the comments & didn't want her bullied over it, I would not be okay with it because no, I do not believe it is a parents right to alter their childs body for cosmetic purposes. And I do wonder where those of you who are okay with kids altering their bodies in cosmetic ways to avoid bullying would draw the line. ?

My best friend in Elementary school was "chubby" despite the fact she was VERY active and ate healthy. She was a chubby baby and she just hung onto the baby fat longer than other kids. She was not obese or unhealthy, she was just chunky. She was tormented for it, too. What do you suggest should have been done in her situation? Should she have went on a diet at the age of 7 (despite her doctor saying she was perfectly fine) and spent her whole time obsessing over her weight, because kids are mean & teased her about it?

I was teased between 11-14 for my lack of breasts. I would go home crying, and I even stuffed my bra. Should I have been allowed to have breast implants to get ignorant kids off my back? But then I would have been a slut for having boobs, so that wouldn't have worked, either.

My 4 year old is very, VERY hairy. He has dark hair on his arms, and I'm sure once he starts school there will be rude kids that give him hell over it. Should I force him to have uncomfortable laser treatments, to save him the grief of rude kids? I'd much rather teach him that he is perfect the way he is, as is everyone else.. regardless of their physical appearance, and those who say otherwise don't matter.

Bottom line is, kids are mean. There will always be bullies, and they will ALWAYS, ALWAYS find something to pick on others over. Even the skinny, beautiful, flawless girl gets picked on for being too pretty. Mean kids assume she is a slut, or fake, etc. It's just an unfortunate part of life, and I personally don't think it's healthy to teach our kids, "other's don't like that about you? That's okay, we'll go under the knife and fix it." That'll be "fixed," and then they will find something else to fuss about. So what does she expect? A quick fix. I'd rather teach my children that these kids have insecurities of their own which is why they feel the need to pick on others, and to love themselves regardless what others think.

But yes, to each their own. :)

You're giving example of instances that either change themselves, or can't be changed. This is an example of a girl with a birth defect. She's not going to grow out of that, so why make her face the teasing? Let her get teased for what kids get teased about, but a birth defect seems like a silly thing to be so adamantly "It's her decision" about.

No, the breast example isn't an issue that "changed itself" or can't be changed. They remained small, and implants would fix that. LOL.

It may seem silly to you, but birth defect or not, if it's not something SHE wants done, or it's not something that is affecting her health, then it's not my right to put her through unnecessary procedures that come with risk.

I doubt any parents would bring their kid kicking and screaming to get their ear fixed - if the kid was really against it, and the parent was forcing it, then there'd be a lot more issues to worry about regarding the parenting! But the parent still makes the ultimate decision - the decision to allow the kid to have surgery or not. It's a decision with consequences either way - whether the parent decides for or against the surgery. You could equally say that the parent has no right to allow a vulnerable child who is unaware of the ways of the world to enter school with an obvious deformity for which there is a very high risk that she will get severely bullied, and which is going to give her unwanted attention and repulsed reactions throughout her life, which is likely to lead to self-consciousness, shame and emotional damage and which could have been easily fixed by small procedure with very low risk.

Small breasts don't really fall into the same category as they aren't an actual deformity! To have an ear that is bent over is going to make people say 'Urgh! Gross! OMG, what happened to you! How awful!' and people will stare. That doesn't happen with small boobs (I have small boobs myself, so am aware of the type of teasing that happens! ;D And the small boob situation does change itself, in that when you're an adult, no one makes a deal of it any more.). With a bent-over ear, sure, you could do what people do with burn victims and give the kid counselling on how to deal with stares, and try to reinforce that they are not a freak, but that is a lengthy and complicated process, considering what a simple procedure it is to fix it!

It's obviously different, but comparisons could be made with cochlear implants. Deafness isn't considered by all to be a disability - some people are very against cochlear implants, because it's forcing the kid to conform to the 'norm' of the hearing world, rather than celebrating their difference. And it carries risks - considerably more risk than a simple ear pinning! And, as with ear pinning, the earlier it's done, the more effective it will be. But whatever the parent chooses - whether to go ahead with the surgery or not to - that is a conscious decision, and it will impact on the child's life. And whichever option the parent chooses, the child may be grateful or may regret it. So the parent does what they feel is right.

I would choose the ear pinning if I had a kid with a bent over ear. Because I genuinely can't imagine any adult saying 'Damn, Mom - I wish you hadn't got my ear straightened when I was a kid! I'd have been a much stronger well-rounded person if you'd let me keep my ear in its original deformed state!' But I can totally imagine an adult saying 'Mom, why didn't you get my ear pinned back when I was a kid? School was a nightmare for me, and I've never really got used to the stares.'

@ Red Frag; does the UK have a specific time frame for circumcision, if ever? I know that American doctors usually do it right away. I personally don't have an opinion on it since I don't have kids but I just thought this was interesting. Everyone always told me that the penis is easier to clean when circumcised since I know most ppl nowadays circumcise for cleanliness reasons (I'd assume) instead of religious reasons.

Most here are done after 6 months (oldest I've known for religious reasons was 3 years, but it can be done at any age if there's health reasons). We don't do them at birth here, and I find that quite horrific. No-one is circumcised here for cleanliness purposes, and the cleanliness argument is myth. Infections are no more common in boys who have a foreskin than those who don't. Most men here are not circumcised and they seem to manage just fine at keeping their bits clean!

I know when I was in primary school (early to late 90's) a lot of kids had their ears pinned back, I really don't think it's a significant issue - it helped a great deal of the people i knew and they became less self-conscious and happy people. I mean there was a story not too long ago about a mother giving botox to her daughter, while I've seen how it can REALLY HELP children with cerebal palsy, I don't see the need to give it to a child to "prevent wrinkles" thats total bull****. So yeh, ear pinning: no big deal, I also think that if a child has had an accident such as a dog attack or something, then plastic surgery can be useful (a lot of this happened when I was younger as well..I knew a few people who had plastic surgery after dog attacks) but when it comes to botox or implants - then thats a different story.

I'd have my daughters done if she wanted it done. I don't really see the big deal aside from the fact its an operation, and operations are scary! its not like a boob job for a 7 year old or botox injections or something, its something that could prevent alot of hurt for the little girl later on.

But i guess it depends on the circumstance. when my daughter 8 weeks old we noticed she has a birth mark by the side of her mouth. my MIL said we should have it removed by the time she starts school, its a cafe au lait mark that will probably be able to be hidden by makeup later on, but we did consider whether it should be removed, and came to the conclusion that its up to her, if she runs into issues with it in the future i'd take her somewhere to be taught about makeup on it, and then if she really wanted it removed we would get it done, however i think theres possible scarring issues involved in this moreso than the ear pinning op.

Wow I would hardly call this 'plastic surgery'.

*do, lol.

I was talking the other day to my bf about when I got braces, I didn't go into great deal but I basically said "trust me, if I had never had braces, you wouldn't be with me right now" he claims he would - but I can guarantee it would be a whole different story. My parents first took me to a dentist when I was about 7 and I had retainers and so forth until I was about 11 and then I was able to get braces. I had an 11-12mm overbite - it was seriously shocking and up until I started getting dental work done I was struggling to make friends and I stuck to myself.

I don't recall my parents consulting me. They never sat me down and said "here are your options" and I never would have known about it in the first place. I never would have walked up to my parents and asked if anyone could fix it - because at 7, I just assumed thats how life was. There was no way of fixing anything in the world!

In saying that - I'm ECSTATIC my parents didn't consult me. I'm GLAD they dragged me to the dentist, I'm THRILLED the dentist put braces on me and in no way am I being sarcastic. I would have had a VERY different life had I not had it done, ESPECIALLY at that age. It was a pivotal time because I was just about to go into high school and those years would have been hell for me if I still had that overbite. I would in no way be the person I am today and I certainly wouldn't have the confidence I have today.

I got a compliment from the bf's family about my teeth the other day and that makes me extremely happy, because yes - even though it was hell for me at the time, in the end, the result was worth it.

Part of the reason I got it done so young was because at that age things are still moving and forming (my overbite would have gotten worse as I grew) so moving my teeth back, as painful as it was sometimes, was nothing compared to how it could have been if I had braces when I was older.

no "first took me to a dentist" obviously I went to dentist before that. But when it was specifically regarding the prospect of fixing my teeth, they took me when i was 7.