I know that there are a lot of people out there who chose not to vaccinate their children. I'm just curious - will hearing that this study is a fraud make you re-consider your choice in not vaccinating your kids?


(CNN) -- A now-retracted British study that linked autism to childhood vaccines was an "elaborate fraud" that has done long-lasting damage to public health, a leading medical publication reported Wednesday.

An investigation published by the British medical journal BMJ concludes the study's author, Dr. Andrew Wakefield, misrepresented or altered the medical histories of all 12 of the patients whose cases formed the basis of the 1998 study -- and that there was "no doubt" Wakefield was responsible.

"It's one thing to have a bad study, a study full of error, and for the authors then to admit that they made errors," Fiona Godlee, BMJ's editor-in-chief, told CNN. "But in this case, we have a very different picture of what seems to be a deliberate attempt to create an impression that there was a link by falsifying the data."
Britain stripped Wakefield of his medical license in May. "Meanwhile, the damage to public health continues, fueled by unbalanced media reporting and an ineffective response from government, researchers, journals and the medical profession," BMJ states in an editorial accompanying the work.

[The article is much longer, so I didn't want to post it all]
http://www.cnn.com/2011/HEALTH/01/05/autism.vaccines/index.html?hpt=T2

You know my stance on this. The risks of vaccinating are so miniscule compared to the risks you incur if you DON'T vaccinate. I can understand if there is a known allergy/reaction to a component of a vaccine, but to avoid vaccinations based on stories like this or that Desiree chick who claimed to develop dystonia after a flu vaccine is, in my opinion, just stupidity! The parents who avoid vaccines because of these weird conspiracy theories weren't around when so many people were dying from the diseases the vaccines themselves protect us from. Measles, mumps, rubella, smallpox, diphtheria, tetanus... they are all horrific diseases to experience and, more often than not, deadly.

I agree. There are certain vaccines that I just don't think I'll have my kids get once they're in school. Like varicella. I had chicken pox. Yeah it sucked, but I put this creamy crap on and it was fine. I was playing video games the whole time I was off school, and I never had to get another varicella shot after that.

My sister always got the vaccine, and then got unlucky and caught it when she was like 18 (she caught it from me.) and it left her with scars all over. I'd rather my kids have it when they're kids and itch for a few days, than get the vaccine and be unlucky and catch it somehow when they're adults. Noo way. I saw how distraught my sister was over having those scars all the time - I wouldn't wish that on anyone.

I think Jenny McCarthy has a little egg on her face.

I was never in any doubt that my kids were going to get their vaccinations. The MMR/autism study never really convinced me. I think what fuelled it was a lot of parents with autistic children that wanted someone or something to blame for the suffering of their child - a perfectly natural reaction. This guy seriously messed with peoples heads. I don't think parents were stupid (uneducated but not stupid) in not having their children vaccinated during the scare... it's a natural instinct of the parent to protect their child, and if a parent doesn't know any better, then they are going to believe that this vaccine will harm their child. I'm glad this idiots been exposed now (I read about it a few months back I think). Now parents can get their kids vaccinated with a clear conscience that they are doing the best for the health of their child.

Jessica - I had no idea there was a chicken pox vaccination. I don't think we have that in the UK. I agree that in cases like Chicken pox were there's no real danger to a persons health, we should opt for building up natural immunity.

@ennui - it's actually required by the school system in my city to have the varicella vaccine (unless your child has already HAD chicken pox)

I can't tell you how many times I've been asked for my immunization record from school. They ask for MMR, Varicella and Polio as a requirement for going to school. I think they've added another since I've been out, but I wouldn't even know what it is.

It's available in the UK but isn't on the routine childhood vaccination schedule.

my daughter was vaccinated. however it does scare me when i saw in the benefits office one day 'application for the fund for the vaccine damaged' ... now why would they have such a thing if people didn't get damaged by vaccinations?
not necesserily relavant to the MMR, but every parents should weigh up the risks and research, and i don't believe theres benefit for over vaccination for things like chicken pox, a mild childhood illness they don't vaccinate for in the uk at all.

People can die from chicken pox, so it is not 'mild' in some cases. I am unsure of the risks, but I do believe that dying from chicken pox is more likely than dying from the vaccine.

but the vaccination is not 100% effective, and according to some websites can increase the risks for older people catching shingles... which is more deadly than chicken pox in the first place, hence why the uk doesn't give this vaccination to children. I imagine the death rate for children getting chicken pox is much much lower than adults having it.
vaccination should perhaps be used for vulnerable adults who don't have the immunity.

@November Butterfly: Nothing is 100% effective, which is why no one ever talks about vaccinations not being 100% effective.

no of course not, but 75-85% effective is surely not the best they can do? i dont know.

@November Butterfly: Who says the vaccinations have lower than a 75% succession rate?

noone?? it says the vaccine is 75-85% successful, higher in preventing a serious case of chicken pox, however some children were found to lose their immunity after a little as 5 years. as opposed to catching chicken pox, which gives you lifelong immunity.

i'm done here, i don't know enough about the chicken pox vaccine other than what i've read as i havent had it, because they don't give it here... i've never had to think about it.

Dying from chicken pox is EXTREMELY rare in childhood. And even in adults it's pretty rare. Adults are much more at risk from serious consequences of chicken pox like pneumonia and encephalitis though. The UK doesn't vaccinate against it (except in at-risk groups) because it's really not necessary in childhood. I can see an argument for vaccinating adults who have never had chicken pox (perhaps at university age), but I really think there's no good medical grounds for vaccinating children against chicken pox (not to mention their immunity most likely won't last into adulthood, the time at which they're in most danger).

i didn't even know there was a study, i just thought people were being ridiculous. if i have kids, they'll be getting vaccinated.

I have two things to say.

1. There's a huge difference between MMR and Chicken Pox vax.. The chicken pox vax ought to be looked at like the flu shot. Doesnt mean you will not get it - means if you do it should be a milder case then had you not. Ki had the vax and has had the illness. They (the medical powers that be) agree that the vax needs a booster just arent sure when it needs to be given.

2. I have a daughter who is the autisum "rainbow" - she did have all her vax - but i dont think that there's a link. This doc ought to be ashamed

@meghans follie - I'm not saying there isn't a huge difference between MMR and Varicella. There definitely is.

I was using it as an example because the kids here are required to get MMR, Varicella and Polio vaccines if they attend public schools. (I can't vouch for private as I've never gone to one.)

I completely agree. Measles, mumps and rubella have far more catastrophic consequences than chicken pox. Not to mention the loss of herd immunity as a result of parents not vaccinating their children also puts vulnerable children (i.e. those with inadequate immune systems like children with leukaemia), who can't have the vaccine, at serious risk.

My nephew got vaccinated for the chicken pox and still got it.. Its like "ok that was a waste of money!"

Yep same with my brother and I.
We both always had to get them for school, then one day I came home covered in chicken pox.
All three kids had it within the next couple days.

my SIL took my nephew to the dr and she said that the vaccine[chicken pox] wares off after age 5.

@redfraggle: my godmother had the chicken pox when she was in her 20's and boy was she in a lot of pain. i'm glad i got them when i was yonger.

Well how dumb. I know I got forms in HIGH SCHOOL asking for proof I'd recently gotten a varicella vaccine.

So pointless.

Yes, but a lot of pain is not the same as life threatening. And I already said I can see a reason to vaccinate adults against it. Just not children. Also, shingles is extremely painful and it is a reactivation of the virus. It occurs in people who've HAD chicken pox, and can occur in people who've been vaccinated.

I remember the chicken pox. Apparently we were at the airport picking up my aunt who was going to be staying with us for a week or two, I told my mum I was itchy and I kept scratching; she took me to the bathroom, lifted up my top and hey presto: CHICKENPOX! My sister followed suit about half a week later. I dont remember it being such a big deal, I remember needing a lot of Calamine Lotion and applying it to the spots that weren't even itchy but other than that it wasn't anything special. Except for my moments of being a little melo-dramatic because I was itchy so I'd throw a tantrum, it wasn't a big deal for me. Besides, 5 years later - for some reason Mosquitoes took a liking to me (I was like a glass of ice cold water in the middle of the Sahara to them) and it actually looked/felt worse than chicken pox and THAT was worse for me, that was WEEKS of HELL!!!

I don't know, maybe I don't understand the severity of childhood chicken pox, but I always thought it was part of childhood - like bumps, bruises and perhaps a broken arm. Rite of passage type situation haha.

But looking at the bigger picture, I don't have kids and I probably have some time before I do, I think chances are I'll vaccinate. I've been vaccinated, I even had the HPV vaccination not too long ok (OK I didn't get that flu one because I didn't feel I was at a high enough risk of contracting it) but even the HPV had it's risks.

I don't mean any disrespect to anyone who doesn't want to vaccinate, and I've always said that I believe all people are good to have their own beliefs and opinions, I only ever speak on how I think things should be for ME, my potential children and so forth, (in otherwords, if you want to do something, do it, so long as it doesn't have any impact on me haha). I'll vaccinate because I feel, for me and my potential children, the Pro's outweigh the Con's at this stage. If that ever swings in the other direction, I'll reconsider, but that's a bridge I'll cross if I ever encounter it.