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Why oh why is there no flaming and debate thread on this law recently passed in the state of Arizona on Bloop? With all the hot topics and issues that have been debated on here, I am kind of surprised to not see one.
More info: http://www.azleg.gov/legtext/49leg/2R/bills/SB1070S.pdf
I would hope everyone sees it as an evil and disgusting law that violates many rights.
I'm not sure why the United States is all about taking away rights and citizenship of immigrants and foreigners this year, but this little trend needs to stop before it progresses into something much bigger.
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I think it's because of all the terrorist attacks.
As in, that's making people terrified of immigrants of any nationality.
Which is definitely stupid.
1. "Evil" is associated with dieties. It removes responsibility. 'it's not my fault, i was possessed, the devil made me do it. and so on...
In reality there's no such thing as "evil" One may have an opinion, right or wrong, doesn't make one opinion, or action- "evil"
2. Try and reverse the tables. Take a look at how Mexico treats it;s illegal American citizens. Lets adopt Mexico's immigration laws:
•In Mexico legally;
•Have the means to sustain themselves economically;
•Not destined to be burdens on society;
•Of economic and social benefit to society;
•Of good character and have no criminal records; and
•Contributors to the general well being of the nation.
"The law also ensures that:
•Authorities have a record of each foreign visitor;
•Foreign visitors do not violate their visa status;
•Foreign visitors are banned from interfering in the country's internal politics;
•Foreign visitors who enter under false pretenses are imprisoned or deported;
•Foreign visitors violating the terms of their entry are imprisoned or deported;
•Those who aid in illegal immigration will be sent to prison."
•Foreigners are admitted into Mexico "according to their possibilities of
contributing to national progress." (Article 32)
•Immigration officials must 'ensure' that 'immigrants will be useful elements for the country and that they have the necessary funds for their sustenance' and for their dependents. (Article 34)
•Foreigners may be barred from the country if their presence upsets 'the equilibrium of the national demographics,' when foreigners are deemed detrimental to 'economic or national interests,' when they do not behave like good citizens in their own country, when they have broken Mexican laws, and
when 'they are not found to be physically or mentally healthy.' (Article 37)
•The Secretary of Governance may 'suspend or prohibit the admission of foreigners when he determines it to be in the national interest.' (Article 38)
•Mexican authorities must keep track of every single person in the country:
•Federal, local and municipal police must cooperate with federal immigration authorities upon request, i.e., to assist in the arrests of illegal immigrants. (Article 73)
•A National Population Registry keeps track of 'every single individual who comprises the population of the country,' and verifies each individual's identity. (Articles 85 and 86)
•A national Catalog of Foreigners tracks foreign tourists and immigrants (Article 87), and assigns each individual with a unique tracking number (Article 91).
Foreigners with fake papers, or who enter the country under false pretenses, may be imprisoned:
•Foreigners with fake immigration papers may be fined or imprisoned. (Article 116)
•Foreigners who sign government documents 'with a signature that is false or different from that which he normally uses' are subject to fine and imprisonment. (Article 116)
Foreigners who fail to obey the rules will be fined, deported, and/or imprisoned as felons:
•Foreigners who fail to obey a deportation order are to be punished. (Article 117)
•Foreigners who are deported from Mexico and attempt to re-enter the country without authorization can be imprisoned for up to 10 years. (Article 118)
•Foreigners who violate the terms of their visa may be sentenced to up to six years in prison (Articles 119, 120 and 121). Foreigners who misrepresent the terms of their visa while in Mexico - such as working with out a permit - can also be imprisoned.
•Under Mexican law, illegal immigration is a felony. The General Law on Population says,
•A penalty of up to two years in prison and a fine of three hundred to five thousand pesos will be imposed on the foreigner who enters the country illegally. (Article 123)
•Foreigners with legal immigration problems may be deported from Mexico instead of being imprisoned. (Article 125)
•Foreigners who 'attempt against national sovereignty or security' will be deported. (Article 126)
•Mexicans who help illegal aliens enter the country are themselves considered criminals under the law.
•A Mexican who marries a foreigner with the sole objective of helping the foreigner live in the country is subject to up to five years in prison. (Article 127)
•Shipping and airline companies that bring undocumented foreigners into Mexico will be fined. (Article 132)"
Fair is fair.
3. It's not fair for those that want to come into any country legally, to have to take a back seat to those that came be illegal means, as proposed with amnesty.
For illegals to run away from their own problems, and create such an enormous burden on working class americans it so outrageous!
What they need to do is clean up their political corruption. Because Mexico is a rich land resource wise, per-capita, than the US is.
One must respect the laws of foreign lands. And respect the borders. Not doing so usually leads to war.
The law must always be respected. No excuse. You can change a law, but you do it legally. When law breakers are rewarded, the system has failed.
1. I don't literally mean "evil."
2. Good thing we're not Mexico and don't follow Mexican rules. How they treat they immigrants is totally irrelevant -- therefore, tl;dr
1. You should always say what you mean. and mean what you say
2. It's very relevant. For someone to run away from their own problems, and come here to complain about us, well damn it, stop running from your problem and trying to force the US to cater to you. Mexico is a richer land, clean up your own mess, and obey the laws of foreign lands. That is all that is being asked, obey the law.
Here in NV. it's illegal for anyone to not have ID on them when out in public. It's also loitering if you don't have at least two dollars on you when out in public.
Unfortunately we don't enforce Nevada laws as much as they should be.
1. I'm not going to begin speaking literally. It's your own problem if you can't pick up anything from sarcasm, implications, exaggerations, or anything similar.
2. That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that Mexico's laws should have absolutely no effect on America's laws. Their government has nothing to do with us. The entire idea of this country is based on immigration -- people coming here and achieving where they couldn't in their own countries. Abuse of the system is a problem, but this isn't the way we should go about solving it.
Also, illegal immigration wouldn't be such a major problem if applying for citizenship or a visa were a bit easier. See what I mean?
1. It's true. when so called atheist give credit to religion in using the word "evil" the ignorance really ticks me off.
2. Dude, if you do not address the root cause of the problem, corruption IN Mexico. Making it easier to run away from the problem, solves nothing, it only creates more problems.
1. I'm not an atheist in the sense of what you think the word means. I just don't claim to know for sure whether or not God or an afterlife exists.
2. Please click my link.
1. Does evil exist then?
2. I'm not found of cartoons. However, I have had some personal experiences with visas and trying to bring people into the US. it's not easy. I was unable to do it.
The point is, a bandaid on a gaping wound, infects the wound in this case, and does not cure/solve anything. It crates more problems.
The root problem must be addressed and cured. we must stop being enablers to corruption. Millions protest here for rights for illegals. Go to Mexico and protest the root cause that makes them run away to begin with. and to run away from a richer land, is just ridiculous.
Well at this point you're just ignoring my points, so this conversation is done.
I accept your defeat
For the record I addressed everything you said.
your stupid link did say anything I don't already know. yes, our immigration laws cold use some reform.
but you keep on ignoring the root cause. which i why i said over and over if you not not address the root cause, you solve nothing, you only create bigger problems. You ignore the root cause completely. which is why you;re a chicken running around with is head chopped off in a blind little circle. Get to the core, it is the best solution. it's a win win for both sides of the fence. Mexico is a richer land and its people deserve a government that isn't so corrupted. They deserve a government that is for the people, not for their own pockets!
Your retarded link completely ignores the root problem. It ignores it 100% just like you have ignored the root cause, making me repeat it over and over.
it's just amazing how much you project what yo do, and don't like about yourself, onto others. In a classic Chris ending of call everyone what you yourself are doing
Thanks, Dr. Tommy. I didn't realize your psychology degree enabled you to analyze personalities over the internet based on a few lines of text.
Are you really sure I'm the one projecting here?
yes Chris. Because i did address your points. all of them.
and you kept ignoring my point of addressing the root core of the problem.
Please address the root core of why so many people want to run away from their country's problems, and make the problem that of the US. address that! I addressed each of your points. You have not addressed my main point! and so you accuse me of doing what YOU ARE doing.
any fifth grader can see that, no psychology classes are needed
I'm ignoring that point because it's irrelevant. If you're going to respond to ME, respond to MY points. I don't give a shit about Mexican government, broski. Really. I never mentioned it, it doesn't discredit my point in the slightest bit, and I really, really don't want to have these retarded discussions with you. It's just going to lead to you giving inaccurate descriptions of my personality, my history on Bloop, and my life, simply because you debate like an angry 5 year old girl, and I'm not going to sit on this thread and babysit you like I did in the other one.
This conversation is over.
lol. more projecting. very cute.
ignoring the root cause of the problem, solves nothing. You know it;s true, and it dismiss your ridiculous pints. so of course you will ignore it.
take care homeboy :)
ps. you have to try and let by gones be by gones. let it go, let your grudges go. I pay no mind to who i talk to, i treat everyone the same- flacless internet people, all the same. an opposing side and nothing more.
Also, Mexico's problems aren't our problem.
exactly. so Mexicans must address their own problems and stop running away from them, and creating a bigger problem for both Mexico and the US. You want it to be perfectly fine for Mexico's problems to be ours, but not the other way around. I'm talking about being fair, and having justice.
You're talking about everyone should run to the US in any way they can. This way less people will protest and take action to clean up their own country. and just run away to the US and let the working class americans pay for Mexico's problems!
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Personally I dont agree with this law. I do however think something needs to be done to secure our border and we either need to start deporting the illegal immigrants, or they need to start doing the paperwork to make them legal.
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I understand what they're trying to do with the law, but don't agree with how they're trying to do it. I live in Arizona and I have a friend at work who's hispanic and was born in the US but she carries her birth certificate around with her now just to be safe. When it comes down to having to carry your birth certificate wherever you go, somethings wrong.
Music God CJ Plain
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That's just it...you don't have to carry your BIRTH certificate. You only have to carry LEGAL ID or Immigration papers to prove that you are here LEGALLY. That's NOT unreasonable at all. All Americans are required to do so in the form of driver's licenses, state id's, car insurance, social security cards, etc.
WHY is it unreasonable that THEY be required to do the same thing? This law is LONG overdue and wouldn't even be necessary if the federal government did their stupid job.
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if people didn't break the law then this wouldn't have to happen. being here illegally is ILLEGAL.
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Exactly, being here illegally is illegal, they are breaking the law and should not be here if they are going to do so. If an immigrant wants to live here they need to get a green card or get citizenship. It's only fair to have to do that if you are going to live in this country and use our resources and government aide. It's not fair to drain the economy even more with illegal immigrants, it's not fair to use government resources and aide if you are here illegally. Asking them to carry a driver's license or state ID is not a big inconvenience at all, it's something us citizens do every day. I think ever state should impose this law or one similar to it. With our economy as bad as it is the last thing we need is more people here illegally, draining our economy even more.